I would like to ask, is ARM's MCU also developed using languages such as VERILOG or VHDL? How is the production process controlled?

一沙一世

I would like to ask, is ARM's MCU also developed using languages such as VERILOG or VHDL? How is the production process controlled? [Copy link]

 

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I would like to ask, is ARM's MCU also developed using languages such as VERILOG or VHDL? How is the production process controlled? For example, is the MCU made using 28nm or 7nm technology?

一沙一世

No one understands, or is the question I asked too ignorant?

wsmysyn

ARM MCU CPUs are basically bought with ARM IP, which is integrated into the CPU. There is no need to modify anything. Other simple low-speed peripherals such as IIC/UART/SPI/IIS, etc., are built-in EDA tools and can be directly generated. Design needs to do IP connection, power supply planning, clock tree, bus bridge, and some special IP design, etc. The main work is debugging. Generally, most of them are Verilog in China.

You can buy analog IP or design it yourself, using Verilog A or just building the circuit yourself.

As for how many processes to use, it is a choice after balancing the application scenario, performance, function, cost, etc.

Most chips have similar processes... not just MCU,

一沙一世

wsmysyn posted on 2023-3-25 14:35 ARM MCU CPU basically buys ARM IP and integrates it. There is no need to change anything. Other simple low-speed peripherals IIC/UART/SPI/IIS, etc...

Thank you very much. I feel like VERILOG is just drawing a schematic diagram. How is the specific underlying hardware circuit implemented?

hahajing

Verilog only describes the hardware structure or function, and FPGA uses

led2015

Isn't it said on the Internet that ARM's MCU is not developed using HDL languages such as Verilog or VHDL, but rather using high-level languages such as C or assembly?

wsmysyn

led2015 posted on 2023-3-25 20:41 Isn't it said on the Internet that ARM's MCU is not developed in HDL languages such as Verilog or VHDL, but in high-level languages such as C or assembly?

ARM previously open-sourced the source code of the M0 core, which was written in Verilog.

As far as we know, high-level languages are also converted into Verilog through tools, and then synthesized by EDA tools, such as Chisel. Currently, EDA does not support direct circuit synthesis of such high-level languages.

After a layer of language packaging, generating Verilog will definitely be a bit verbose, but the development efficiency is high, but the performance is not necessarily better than the native one. Currently, the mainstream still uses Verilog or vhdl

wsmysyn

Yishayishi published on 2023-3-25 15:28 Thank you very much. I feel like VERILOG just draws a schematic diagram. How is the specific underlying hardware circuit implemented?

Verilog hdl or vhdl is called hardware description language, which is used to describe circuits, just like drawing a schematic diagram. To implement the circuit, you need EDA tools to synthesize it. In this process, you need corresponding process library data, just like the package library of PCB, with the generated netlist, call the corresponding std cell library, for example, if you need 10 million gate circuits, generate data of 10 million gate circuits, import it into the layout tool to do layout, and similar to PCB, place these gate circuits according to the connection relationship. Digital circuit layout is generally automatically laid out and routed by EDA tools, and analog layout is generally manually laid out. After the layout is ok, the tool generates a GDSII file, which is similar to the gerber file of PCB, and gives it to the fab factory to make a mask, and then it can be produced.

吾妻思萌

Alas, design and manufacturing are basically two different things. In VHDL, you design how many gates I need, how to connect them, etc. Then the corresponding person will convert the schematic into a layout, where to put a layer of silicon, where to coat, how thick to make it, etc.

zhaoyanhao

How can ordinary MCU use 7nm process? STMicroelectronics' new series is only 40nm

chunyang

The original poster's description is not clear. Is it application development or chip development? They are two completely different things. VHDL and Verilog are used for application development of programmable array chips. Although there are ready-made resources that support ARM, they are simulation cores, not real MCUs. The two are completely different things. There are dedicated EDA tools for chip development.

As for production process control, that is the business of chip manufacturers, and the design is just to adapt to the corresponding process. Which process is appropriate is a business issue, not a technical issue.

一沙一世

chunyang posted on 2023-3-27 12:24 The original poster's description is not clear. Is it application development or chip development? Those are two completely different things. VHDL and Verilog are used for programmable arrays...

May I ask, [There is a dedicated EDA tool for chip development] What is this dedicated EDA tool? Thank you.

chunyang

Yishayishi published on 2023-3-27 14:59 May I ask, [There is a dedicated EDA tool for chip development] What is this dedicated EDA tool? Thank you.

Different chip manufacturers, different types of ICs and different design stages use different EDA tools. Knowing the names is meaningless and you can't get them. They are all very professional and dedicated software and are not open to the public.

一沙一世

chunyang posted on 2023-3-27 18:47 Different chip manufacturers, different types of ICs and different design stages use different EDA tools. Knowing the name is meaningless, and you can't help but...

Thank you. Now many domestic manufacturers develop chips based on ARM CORTEX-M0 or M0+. What EDA software do they use?

chunyang

Yishayishi published on 2023-3-27 19:47 Thank you. Now many domestic manufacturers are developing chips based on ARM CORTEX-M0 or M0+. What EDA software do they use?

I don't know. As I said, different manufacturers have different choices.

WangXiaoHe

All digital circuits are developed using VHDL or Verilog hardware description language. Before development, you must obtain its process library. For example, 7ns, 16ns, etc. These process libraries are needed when you perform logic synthesis and when designing the layout.

WangXiaoHe

The format of the hardware description language that can be synthesized must be RTL format, otherwise it cannot be synthesized. There are also two methods for synthesis: FPGA and ASIC. Different synthesis tools are used, and different synthesis methods are adopted. You must understand it clearly in advance.